THIS IS DONALD NATHAN REPLYING TO MIKE FOULKS 10/24/07:
MF:Thank you, Mr. Nathan.
DN:You are welcome, Mr. Foulks.
MF:Yi is not completely wrong. I believe he read a Tribune short posted on the internet which contains the quote. (Another example of why not to believe everything you read.)
DN:"All the news that's fit to print"
MF:I told the Transporation Committe that if they felt that 25% was too high then they should compromise it with their wisdom. I said that whether they give us 25%, 20%, 15%, 10% or whatever amount they see fit, they cannot give us nothing.
DN:That's what I do with Juries. That's what I used to do with passengers in my taxi when the topic of tips came up. I was hoping for 25%, but I was always willing to take "20%, 15%, 10% or whatever amount" they saw fit. I always felt I ought not to be stiffed.
MF:I then looked Mr. Reilly in the eye and told him that if the Council decides to give us nothing, then the next strike, demonstration, rally or march would be extremely disruptive to the traffic flow of his ward, which he had expressed concerns about when defending the ridiculous ticketing of drivers who are doing their jobs up and down Michigan Avenue and the like.
DN:That tack was probably counterproductive, speaking as a lawyer who tries to persuade Juries to award money to clients who have been hurt.
MF:I started to continue by noting the media coverage judging the strike of July 31st as being ineffective because the Loop was unaffected and asserted my honest belief that the Loop will be targeted and affected next time, when Mr. Reyboras raise his voice and said, "Don't come here and threaten us ..." which is when I apologized for any exaggerated tone he might be misinterpreting.
DN:He was only expressing what the lot of them were probably thinking. Respectfully speaking, you stepped over the line, and that was an unfortunate choice.
MF:I then quickly broke down the rest of my testimony into the simple fact of the dramatic gas price increase necessitating a meter increase of some amount, and then basically agreed with all of George and George's proposal except for the one which asked that independent operators not be required to take credit cards by arguing that either all of us shall take them or none of us in consideration of not confusing the passengers.
DN:This might well not have been heard after threatening the Committee members.
MF:I elaborated on the fundamental problems of requiring credit card acceptance and indicated a need to improve the requirements on the cab companies to provide a quicker and more reliable system. I then redirected the Committee to carefully consider the personal testimony of Sayeed, who said that the longer and longer hours are destroying his family life.
DN:Good - important points. Who can drive 14 hours a day 7 days a week in a world with $3/gallon gas?
MF:I agree with your contention that sometimes courage is need to sit in public and speak, but let me assure you that I do not need to summon that kind of courage anymore as I have spoken to all kinds of people in all kinds of settings in my vocation as a cabdriver and elsewhere.
DN:So too have I - 200,000 miles of cab driving and now 32 years of the practice of law, all of it in court before Juries in over 15,000 personal injury and workers compensation cases most of it related to taxi drivers and the taxi industry.
MF:I wish that more of the cabdrivers who spend a lot of time speaking the truth with each other would come and participate in this part of the political process. I intend to make my wishes come true.
DN:Good for you. Good for drivers in general.
MF:I have read some of your messages to other drivers and I thank you for your input, but let me clarify my position of wanting a Cabdriver-Only Organization:
DN:My chauffeur's license number was 11473. I drove from 1968 to 1975, first for Yellow, then American United, then Flash. My first job in civil practice was as the associate for Sherman Dickholtz on the Flash Cab lot. I was one of eight lawyers who represented cab drivers as defendants for Delta Casualty (mostly Flash affiliates) from 1977 to 1995. I represented drivers from American United from offices at 2353 W. Belmont from 1996 to 1998. Over the years, I have represented 7,500 cab drivers as injured victims. I still represent them, but now I limit my practice to catastrophic injuries because I'm semi-retired.
MF:It is much more likely that an outsider has selfish interests incongruent with those of insiders.
DN:The insider-outsider business doesn't cut it if you give it some thought.
I don't need doodly squat any more. I've done pretty well. Half the time I am in my home in the hills east of Monterey, California. My wife says I have too much free time, and I'm trying to give some of it away. You don't want it? Why the hell not? You have nothing I want other than the rights you need and don't have. And I don't think you're any more an "insider" than anyone else.
When I was a kid growing up in New York, there used to be billboards up everywhere depicting a beautiful black guy with a big toothy white smile. He was holding up a huge corned beef sandwich in one hand. Below it read: "YOU DON'T NEED TO BE JEWISH TO ENJOY LEVY'S RYE BREAD".
Do I make my point, Mr. Foulks?
MF:I am not taking the time to judge you,
DN:I hope to gosh not. Then I'd think you just prejudiced. You haven't met me. You don't know jack squat about me other than for what you've read or heard said.
MF:but I have taken the time to judge the AFSC TWO Project and Prateek Sampat and have reached a conclusion that he is no good until proven otherwise.
DN:I'm not here to defend the kid. He's not very mature, however, and it shows in ways that really put a lot of people off. I'm three times his age, so he ****** me off too - maybe more so than you because I've invested my entire 40 year career into the cab industry.
MF:I will read anything you send me, but please do not be offended if my priorities delay an appropriate response.
DN:I expect absolutely nothing from you. If we interact, it's going to be toward the end of winning the things drivers need. Your priorities aren't any different from mine. I just have more time because I'm semi-retired.
MF:I am not in this for the money,
DN:I'm not either. I stand to gain nothing. I'm not looking for more business and need nothing at this point other than to enjoy things that are important to me in this life.
MF:so therefore my time is that much more valuable.
DN:No more valuable than mine is, young man.
MF:I would like to meet you in person some point in the future at our mutual convenience, but please do not seek me out; one of my weaknesses is my politeness. I know you are sophisticated enough to get what I'm trying to express.
DN:I haven't a clue what you're trying to say. I feel no compulsion to meet you in person, although it is likely to happen unless I get sick of trying to give away my time pro bono publico. I'm not the kind who sits in the shadows, but I have no particular reason to seek you out any more so than you do me. I do hope to have been polite in replying to your comments and not to have given offense.
I know you are sophisticated enough to get what I'm trying to express, Mr. Foulks.
Should we meet, however, I'd far prefer to be called by my first name: "Don". Nobody calls me "Slim" any more, but my first name is qutie polite enough. Mr. Nathan died 12 years ago.
Donald Nathan
THIS IS DONALD NATHAN TO YI TANG, ALSO 10/23/07:
Thank you for this link, Yi. Great story. I only wish we could clone a few of those brave men and women to organize here in Chicago. It makes me proud for those I've served over the years to know that spirit does live here, and the sight of those demonstrators should be played over and over for drivers here to see.
THIS YI TANG TO DONALD NATHAN AND A REPLY 10/23/07:
I feel sad about him today begging in the City Hall.
"Give us 5 percent, give us 10 percent. . . . Make a compromise and give us something," driver Mike Foulks said.
If I was wrong, please feel free to correct me.
Yi
You are wrong, Yi - whatever gets done, no one can be too proud to beg for relief even if you can characterize what he did as begging.
Although I wasn't there, it takes courage to sit before that committee and express oneself. Foulks is not to be criticized for whatever he said. Even a token rate increase would help a desperate situation.
Donald Nathan
MIKE FOULKS COMMENTS: Neither Yi Tang or Donald Nathan attended this important hearing for a fare increase at City Hall.
Yi Tang relied on an Internet report from the Chicago Tribune which characterized my comments as "begging".
Others in attendance more accurately characterized my comments as "threatening", for better or worse.
Yi Tang and Donald Nathan:
If both of you are so interested in helping cabdrivers, why did neither of you attend the important hearing for a fare increase or testify like so many others?
-Mike Foulks
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
THIS YI TANG TO DONALD NATHAN AND A REPLY 10/23/07:
I feel sad about him today begging in the City Hall.
"Give us 5 percent, give us 10 percent. . . . Make a compromise and give us something," driver Mike Foulks said.
If I was wrong, please feel free to correct me.
Yi
You are wrong, Yi - whatever gets done, no one can be too proud to beg for relief even if you can characterize what he did as begging.
Although I wasn't there, it takes courage to sit before that committee and express oneself. Foulks is not to be criticized for whatever he said. Even a token rate increase would help a desperate situation.
Donald Nathan
MIKE FOULKS COMMENTS: Neither Yi Tang or Donald Nathan attended this important hearing for a fare increase at City Hall.
Yi Tang relied on an Internet report from the Chicago Tribune which characterized my comments as "begging".
Others in attendance more accurately characterized my comments as "threatening", for better or worse.
THIS IS FROM DONALD NATHAN TO YI TANG 10/23/07:
Mike Foulks is obviously a bright man, a good writer and he seems to want to know what's in it for you to be working toward organizing cab drivers. He wants to know where you've been, what you do now and why you're concerned about the industry. In short, he wants you to drop your trousers so you can be held up to public scrutiny.
Why on earth would you do that?
Foulks is just going to have to understand that there are some people out there who don't have any direct gain to realize by involving themselves in winning some results for drivers. There are some people who just want to give of themselves. It's something they just have to do.
Some such people don't want to get into the limelight. They get enough satisfaction from seeing results that follow from working together. Many people from countries where people don't routinely work together have a hard time understanding why other people from countries where millions act in consort get real pleasure when they see the job done. It's what built the "Great Wall" among other things. It's what brought the British to their knees in South Asia in the late '40's.
My recommendation is that you keep on keeping on - work as you do with others like you to build an organization that can win the things drivers in CHICAGO need: a significant meter increase, periodic review of meter rates to take into account rapid rises in gasoline rates, limitation of lease fees, medical insurance, a pension plan, and on and on and on.
THESE AREN'T PIPE DREAMS FOLKS.
Let Yi Tang and others like him do their thing.
Donald Nathan
former c/l $11473
THIS IS FROM DONALD NATHAN TO YI TANG 10/23/07:
Mike Foulks is obviously a bright man, a good writer and he seems to want to know what's in it for you to be working toward organizing cab drivers. He wants to know where you've been, what you do now and why you're concerned about the industry. In short, he wants you to drop your trousers so you can be held up to public scrutiny.
Why on earth would you do that?
_______________________________________________
Mr. Nathan, why on earth shouldn't Yi Tang tell us "where he's been, what he does now, and why he's so concerned about the industry"?
-Mike Foulks
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Replying to:
THIS IS FROM DONALD NATHAN TO YI TANG 10/23/07:
Mike Foulks is obviously a bright man, a good writer and he seems to want to know what's in it for you to be working toward organizing cab drivers. He wants to know where you've been, what you do now and why you're concerned about the industry. In short, he wants you to drop your trousers so you can be held up to public scrutiny.
Why on earth would you do that?
Foulks is just going to have to understand that there are some people out there who don't have any direct gain to realize by involving themselves in winning some results for drivers. There are some people who just want to give of themselves. It's something they just have to do.
Some such people don't want to get into the limelight. They get enough satisfaction from seeing results that follow from working together. Many people from countries where people don't routinely work together have a hard time understanding why other people from countries where millions act in consort get real pleasure when they see the job done. It's what built the "Great Wall" among other things. It's what brought the British to their knees in South Asia in the late '40's.
My recommendation is that you keep on keeping on - work as you do with others like you to build an organization that can win the things drivers in CHICAGO need: a significant meter increase, periodic review of meter rates to take into account rapid rises in gasoline rates, limitation of lease fees, medical insurance, a pension plan, and on and on and on.
THESE AREN'T PIPE DREAMS FOLKS.
Let Yi Tang and others like him do their thing.
Donald Nathan
former c/l $11473
THIS IS MIKE FOULKS TO YI TANG BEFORE 10/23/07
Re: This is the best I have read so far...
Something Money Can’t Buy ----- Dignity and Respectþ
“The people who do this job are desperate,” Professor Hodges said. When an incentive like yesterday’s special fares comes along, “you don’t have to be a Marxist to understand that that will breed strikebreakers.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/23/nyregion/23nyc.html?ref=nyregion
Yi Tang-
Thank you for your numerous postings containing links to sites with information about what is happening in NYC. While I will always contend that Chicago and New York are fundamentally different taxi business enviroments, we should pay attention to what is happening in NYC, but take enough care to contrast and compare that with what is happening here with these fundamental differences in mind. Simply said, "Chicago is not New York City. (Thank God.)".
I have noticed that both you and Wolfgang Weiss like to interlace your more pratical postings with philosophical quotes and metaphysical statements. Too many of these can lead a conversation astray into the ashtrays what divides us and away from the dinner plate of what we agree on. At least you have given us a lot to chew on instead of blowing smoke.
Could you please post a short bio of yourself so that we can better understnad where you are coming from? When I attended that ridiculous meeting with Prateek Sampat at UNITE-HERE, I think you said that you used to be a cabdriver, but that you are not one now. You gave me a ride over to Carriage Cab in an immaculate, white Town Car limo. Are you a cabdriver or a limo driver? What do you hope to accomplish and what is your interest with organizing cabdrivers?
Thanks again, Yi, for your contributions.
-Mike Foulks
Seriously, Mike, do you think anyone is going to bother slogging through that garbage? And even if they do, who cares about any of it?
Privilege was for you to waive, and you've done so. But there's nothing interesting enough to comment on really. It's just a consummate bore.
Will you answer the 3 questions I asked you a long time ago, Yi Tang?
Could you please post a short bio of yourself so that we can better understnad where you are coming from? When I attended that ridiculous meeting with Prateek Sampat at UNITE-HERE, I think you said that you used to be a cabdriver, but that you are not one now. You gave me a ride over to Carriage Cab in an immaculate, white Town Car limo. Are you a cabdriver or a limo driver? What do you hope to accomplish and what is your interest with organizing cabdrivers?
-Mike Foulks
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
THIS IS MIKE FOULKS TO YI TANG BEFORE 10/23/07
Re: This is the best I have read so far...
Something Money Can’t Buy ----- Dignity and Respectþ
“The people who do this job are desperate,” Professor Hodges said. When an incentive like yesterday’s special fares comes along, “you don’t have to be a Marxist to understand that that will breed strikebreakers.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/23/nyregion/23nyc.html?ref=nyregion
Yi Tang-
Thank you for your numerous postings containing links to sites with information about what is happening in NYC. While I will always contend that Chicago and New York are fundamentally different taxi business enviroments, we should pay attention to what is happening in NYC, but take enough care to contrast and compare that with what is happening here with these fundamental differences in mind. Simply said, "Chicago is not New York City. (Thank God.)".
I have noticed that both you and Wolfgang Weiss like to interlace your more pratical postings with philosophical quotes and metaphysical statements. Too many of these can lead a conversation astray into the ashtrays what divides us and away from the dinner plate of what we agree on. At least you have given us a lot to chew on instead of blowing smoke.
Could you please post a short bio of yourself so that we can better understnad where you are coming from? When I attended that ridiculous meeting with Prateek Sampat at UNITE-HERE, I think you said that you used to be a cabdriver, but that you are not one now. You gave me a ride over to Carriage Cab in an immaculate, white Town Car limo. Are you a cabdriver or a limo driver? What do you hope to accomplish and what is your interest with organizing cabdrivers?
Thanks again, Yi, for your contributions.
-Mike Foulks
Mr. Foulks:
Have you posted these E-Mails yet at the O’Hare? Why not so if they are important to all drivers to know?
I find that it is impossible to follow up your logic for keeping secrets from drivers. Is it the time for you to clean up CCO’s closet like a garage sale?
I would be more interested in about the performances of the previous elected vice president of CCO, like any reader of the Tribune. Has he resigned (or been fired) according to the Articles of Organization of CCO?
Anything else you have been hiding? The “truth” please, Mr. Foulks!
Mr. Tang
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
Wolfgang J. Weiss,
Thanks for the "blast from the past"!
December 3, 2007? Let's set the way-back machine a little further...
A perfect segue into rarely-seen before e-from my "least-favorite lawyer", Donald S. Nathan.
Enjoy reading, everyone!
-Mike Foulks, President, Chicago Cabdriver Organization (CCO)
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
The previous post is from Mr. Presiddont's favorite attorney.
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
Balst from the past:
Posted Dec 3, 07 - "The young man is running his head into a wall as far as I can tell - it's a bit like a bull in the ring after the Picadors have riled him up. The harm he does to his cause, and that of all people of good will, is unfortunate - hate is always recognized for what it is; most sensible people disrespect haters."
"My sincere hope is that he might wake up to what he is doing to shoot his organization in its collective foot. Before he hopelessly trashes his future credibility before the Transportation Committee, he should think before shooting off his mouth spewing venom that hurts no one."
"Judging from his continued rantings, these comments are likely to fall on deaf ears. Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised, and he won't carry this on the further; that he will recognize the need to battle with enemies rather than allies."
Mr. Tang,
I have not posted these e-mails anywhere but here. Your suggestion that they "are important to all drivers to know" is simply your characterization of them.
What "secrets" have I been "keeping from drivers"? Your logic is what I find impossible to follow at times like this.
"Is it time for you to clean up CCO's closet like a garage sale?" -Yi Tang.
I have absolutely no idea what you mean by this. Could you explain?
I don't think that most "readers of the Tribune" care about the "performance" of the previous APPOINTED Vice President of the CCO. He was elected to be a Cabdriver-Representative of the CCO, then appointed to Vice President by me.
I haven't ever received any "resignation" from him. He eventually failed to attend two regular CCO meetings in a row and was removed from his positions by me.
I haven't "hid" anything from anyone. You are the first to ask about this.
Yi Tang, you and others should know by now how adamant I am about truth-telling, from myself and others.
Any other questions you would like me to answer, Mr. Tang?
-Mike Foulks
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
Mr. Foulks:
Have you posted these E-Mails yet at the O’Hare? Why not so if they are important to all drivers to know?
I find that it is impossible to follow up your logic for keeping secrets from drivers. Is it the time for you to clean up CCO’s closet like a garage sale?
I would be more interested in about the performances of the previous elected vice president of CCO, like any reader of the Tribune. Has he resigned (or been fired) according to the Articles of Organization of CCO?
Anything else you have been hiding? The “truth” please, Mr. Foulks!
Mr. Tang
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
Wolfgang J. Weiss,
Thanks for the "blast from the past"!
December 3, 2007? Let's set the way-back machine a little further...
A perfect segue into rarely-seen before e-from my "least-favorite lawyer", Donald S. Nathan.
Enjoy reading, everyone!
-Mike Foulks, President, Chicago Cabdriver Organization (CCO)
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
The previous post is from Mr. Presiddont's favorite attorney.
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
Balst from the past:
Posted Dec 3, 07 - "The young man is running his head into a wall as far as I can tell - it's a bit like a bull in the ring after the Picadors have riled him up. The harm he does to his cause, and that of all people of good will, is unfortunate - hate is always recognized for what it is; most sensible people disrespect haters."
"My sincere hope is that he might wake up to what he is doing to shoot his organization in its collective foot. Before he hopelessly trashes his future credibility before the Transportation Committee, he should think before shooting off his mouth spewing venom that hurts no one."
"Judging from his continued rantings, these comments are likely to fall on deaf ears. Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised, and he won't carry this on the further; that he will recognize the need to battle with enemies rather than allies."
Mr. Foulks:
You could well spend the time in promoting your vice president, so he may stay longer with you this time.
Has he ever had any comments or anything to say himself?
Mr. Tang
Mr. Tang,
I'm not here to "promote" any CCO Vice President. Their decision to participate in whatever fashion is their responsibility.
Mr. Syed Z. Ali made many comments which have been recorded at that several CCO meetings he attended.
I think he would have continued participating if some of the other well-known "Cabdriver-Representatives" bothered to show up as well.
-Mike Foulks
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
Mr. Foulks:
You could well spend the time in promoting your vice president, so he may stay longer with you this time.
Has he ever had any comments or anything to say himself?
Mr. Tang
Wolf,
I didn't bribe anybody to vote for me, though a well-known "wino" indeed did vote for me in the first CCO election...he had a current chauffeur's license and a current lease.
Ask Steve Wiedersberg about it. He was supposed to cast one of his two votes for him.
Wolf, you are the Doctor Come Louder of "B.S." and an expert on posting with aliases. I defer you your authority, and your authority, and your authority, and your authority, and your authority, and your authority, etc.
Stay away from fires you can't put out until you bring using some "water", Wolf-flame.
-Mike Foulks, who has a belly-button and a human brain.
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
There is nothing LESS DEMOCRATIC than Mikey, accept his appointing himself and staging a fake election with blank ballots and bribing people to vote.
Hey, did I get a vote? A gave a wino a big bottle Old Rebel Yell.
Of course everyone has the right to use a pen name or handle and there is no "secrecy" or hiding" or "hypocrisy" by not posting one's real name or title of any organization one may be involved with.
That's one of those "non-logical argument" ie., BS of the highest order.
There is no "obvious hypocrisy" other than Foulks trying to pretend he is a human being.
Trying to have a discussion here is like throwing gasoline on fire to try to put it out.
OK Mr, Foulks, you have proven beyond any doubt that you are a prime candidate for hospitalization in a locked ward -- for you own good!
These postings – obvious to even a non medical professional -- are the output of a person suffering from an OBSESSIVE-COMPULSIVE DISORDER.
This is very real debilitative and destructive illness, not just wise remarks or flagrantly abusive commentary.
These postings do not further the cause or provide insight to any of the issues at hand, other than the issue of “one of our own” in deep distress.
When you allow this kind of extremely excessive behavior, you no longer have a "DISCUSSION FORUM, but rather a VOMITORIUM.
We, on this forum sadly can not help this poor demented, tortured soul. I would hope that common sense and decency prevail – must prevail.
It is very saddening for me, personally to see this. I have seen mental illness of this type destroy a very close and true friend.
And I have seen proud and brave men – decorated soldiers who withstood and survived the worst horrors of war one can live through -- succumb to the devils and demons in their heads.
I am hereby abstaining from any further comments regarding Mr. Foulks and his alleged organization.
Mike, I am truly sorry. Please get help.
--Wolfgang J. Weiss—
Wolf,
If you truly believe that I am a "prime candidate for hospitalization in a locked ward", it is you whose mental state needs observing.
Shame on you for using the very real world of mentally ill people in a failed attempt to ridicule or belittle me, someone who simply disagrees with you on political issues or events.
"Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder"? Wolf, it seems that you can't help yourself when you schizophrenically post remarks under many different aliases.
Are you sure that you aren't the one who needs medical attention?
I know for a fact that you suffer from verbal diarrhea.
When you use "we", Wolf, who are you referring to? You and yourself?
Mental illness won't destroy me, Wolf, don't worry. Sorry to hear about your friend.
There are no "devils and demons" in my head, Wolf. Are there any in yours we should know about?
"I am hereby abstaining from any further comments regarding Mr. Foulks and his alleged organization." -Wolf Weiss
If I could only believe this to be true, Wolf. Let me help you by saying that you don't have to quit your abberrant behavior permanently, just each time you get the urge.
Practice right now. See if you can abstain from responding to this current comment from mine. It's not as hard as it seems. Just don't hit "Post Message".
It gets easier with time, Wolf, trust me.
-Mike Foulks
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Replying to:
OK Mr, Foulks, you have proven beyond any doubt that you are a prime candidate for hospitalization in a locked ward -- for you own good!
These postings – obvious to even a non medical professional -- are the output of a person suffering from an OBSESSIVE-COMPULSIVE DISORDER.
This is very real debilitative and destructive illness, not just wise remarks or flagrantly abusive commentary.
These postings do not further the cause or provide insight to any of the issues at hand, other than the issue of “one of our own” in deep distress.
When you allow this kind of extremely excessive behavior, you no longer have a "DISCUSSION FORUM, but rather a VOMITORIUM.
We, on this forum sadly can not help this poor demented, tortured soul. I would hope that common sense and decency prevail – must prevail.
It is very saddening for me, personally to see this. I have seen mental illness of this type destroy a very close and true friend.
And I have seen proud and brave men – decorated soldiers who withstood and survived the worst horrors of war one can live through -- succumb to the devils and demons in their heads.
I am hereby abstaining from any further comments regarding Mr. Foulks and his alleged organization.
Mike, I am truly sorry. Please get help.
--Wolfgang J. Weiss—
