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Re: How much should taxi drivers make? Have you discussed this with CCO?

George wrote: "Not a lot of drivers participated."

If you have tried to discuss this matter with the CCO, you may be able to get a clearer picture from a pool of all 52 drivers.

Will it be too hard?

Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make? Have you discussed this with CCO?

I couldn't get one decent response before someone had to make a mockery over this.

This is why cabdrivers will never get anywhere.

Thank you Mr. Tang. You've been a big help, as usual.

I'm not putting up with this anymore. Any response in this thread that doesn't offer some sort of insight to my question will be deleted. Don't like it? Too bad. Go post somewhere else. You won't be missed.

George Lutfallah
Chicago Dispatcher

Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

in Norma reyes' testimony she claimed to have ‘analyzed fare information collected from drivers’ receipts’
"6000 fares from 100 cabs"
"775 fares from 5 cabs over 11 shifts"
"radio dispatched fares from 50 cabs over 2 week period"

in order to determine whether cabdrivers deserve or 'need' a fare increase. these are direct quotes which are available by going to the transportation committee office and requesting the cassette tape to listen to in their office. which i did.

i was one of the drivers who collected meter receipts and gas receipts for a five day period to offer up to the city some proof that we don't make much. i have also been in touch with people in her dept. to ask if we could get the hard data she said she had. we were told we would have to file a foia to get that.

we of the aupd are requesting of the dept of consumer affairs that they release this data for further analysis. we would dearly love to get this data, because we already know that it will prove that we barely make over minimum wage.

george, i could offer you a number of different ways of analyzing our income which would prove my point, but i hesitate to do it in such a public forum. you know how to reach me.

peter ali enger

Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

December 8th 2007

George,

A cab driver should be entitled to making a decent living.

The city chauffeurs rules and regulations are all against the drivers. The rules and regulations is a big business for the city. When the city department of consumer services wants a raise, they add more rules to the chauffeurs rules and regulations.

We can't make any money, if the city doesn't have the heart to understand that these drivers have families to support, NOT 400 WEST SUPERIOR STREET where all the money is going. 400 WEST SUPERIOR STREET is a place for cab drivers to get in for free, but pay to get out.

When the city writes tickets for a dirty cab or for a CHECK ENGINE LIGHT on the dashboard against the driver, the driver gets a second one to go to the owner to get double the money. Now Carriage Cab company has posted signs informing the drivers that they are responsible for any tickets, which means the drivers must pay for both tickets. Is there a law against the city doing this?

At the October 23rd hearing, the commissioner doesn't know what she's talking about. Those charts she brought with her showing the cost of living index doesn't mean anything, but an excuse for her to deny the cab drivers a raise. This tells us she hates cab drivers for some reason.

I've already stressed this to the commissioner, telling her that there are too many cabs on the street that slows business. So, it's either eliminate a thousand cabs, or give us the raise.

Second thing I told the commissioner, that she and her assistant Ms. Shellie Reidle should drive a cab for a week and see for herself how much money a cab driver is really making. The commissioner and her staff would never make it.

When Norma Reyes was the building commissioner, she was responsible for those 13 people who got killed in Lincoln Park when the porch collasped, because she didn't investigate to see if her staff was out inspecting buildings. Now, she wants to kill cab drivers by keeping money out of their wallets.

It's time for Chicago to get some new political leaders, who'll clean up city government, starting with consumer services and other corrupted departments. As long as Daley and his fifty dwarfs are controling city government, the cab drivers are always going to suffer. The cab drivers are the angels and consumer service staff are the devils who uses their pitch fork jabbing drivers.

Ted Budzynski

Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

Are you talking about new drivers, experienced drivers, drivers with good manners and hygiene, or just average drivers all around?

Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

If you want to compare to bus drivers, I'm sure that they are paid better for years of service, driving record, efficiency among other factors.

Re: Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

Mr. Rahman:

Good points. I suppose in that case that we should consider a driver with little experience and compare that with the starting pay of a bus driver.

If that's the case, how do you gauge what a new cabdriver makes as compared to what an experienced driver makes?

George Lutfallah
Chicago Dispatcher

Re: Re: Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

That's easy. Where does every new cabdriver start working? O'Hare.

Getting average fares and wait times would be a simple task.

Re: Re: Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

O'Hare is right. Inexperienced drivers always start from the same place - O'Hare. Most trips are downtown. Average fare is $35. Take off $2 for the MPEA tax.

In a 12 hour shift a cabdriver will load five times. Net revenue for the day is $165. Gas is $35. Average lease is $50.

Driver takes home $80 after 12 hours. It's not enough, even for an entry level job. Now throw in there the likelihood of getting tickets or costly accidents and the job isn't very attractive.

Any arguments with my figures?

Salim

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

Do you realize that's only $5.71 per hour?

If you figure the first 8 hours as regular pay and the additional 4 as time and a half, drivers who sit at O'Hare are making less than $6 an hour.

Nice to hear from you, Mr. Abunassar!

Mr. Abunassar,

Nice to hear from you. I'm looking at your figure for gas...$35?

I'm assuming you are talking about 'deadheading' five trips out of O'Hare. According to Google Maps, ORD to Chicago is 17.6 miles. Let's round off the round trip to 35 miles.

5 'round trip deadheads' would be 175 miles. At $35, that would be 5 miles to the dollar. If gas is at $3.49 ($3.50) a gallon, that would mean the cab would be getting 17.5 mpg.

But it would need even better gas mileage once you consider the the side trips of going to or from home or the garage.

I don't want to argue with your numbers too much...I'm glad you posted them as a start for a good discussion.

I don't deadhead to O'Hare too much anymore, so I can't challenge you on the assertion that 5 trips are usually made in a 12-hour shift, but the time spent paying the lease and dropping and picking up the cab make me doubt that 5 is the correct number. I would bet it's more often 4 than 6.

I think your number for $35 of gas is too low, or that you happen to have a better-than-average cab with regards to MPG.

I think your number for number of trips (5) and average fare ($35) might be too big. What about all those short trips that ruin the average fare amount? On the night shift, a driver can easily wait over an hour in the short trip lane, putting aside the actual time spent waiting at the terminal itself or completing the fare.

Is the average lease $50 for 12-hours really? I pay a little less for the weekly night shift but I have to pay more for a daily 12-hour. I know it's not $50 for the new drivers at Yellow Cab. I think it's $65-$75!

Maybe we could each do a 'test run' together on a particular day, whaddya say? I could do it next Sunday night 6PM-6AM (when it is VERY busy at O'Hare) or next Thursday night 6PM-6AM. Do you work 6AM-6PM or at night or 24 hours? I'd like to do it on the same day as somebody else does 6AM-6PM.

I cannot do it on Monday or Tuesday night, and not just because I already know I'll go broke if I do it then.

Are there any cabdrivers reading who do this type of driving already? I doubt it...they're at O'Hare.

More importantly Salim, how many miles and how much gas do YOU put on in a 'shift'. What hours do you work and how much do you gross and net?

And do you think that the Commissioner is really going to trust you if your numbers are lower than what she needs to justify denying us a fare increase? Can't she just say that your numbers are unprovable? Can't she just say that you should be happy with $6-$7 per hour? Remember, she said that gas fluctuates and that is on a downward trend. I'm not laughing at that joke.

How bad will it have to get for you and others drivers to join the AUPD or the CCO or the MLTDA to get the respect we deserve? $4.00 a gallon? $70 12-hour leases? $650 a week 24-hour leases? 2 Calls-A-Day? More Re-Education Camps? Crappier cabs?

I don't think drivers are sleeping in their cabs at O'Hare because they're getting rich.

I think drivers are sleeping in their cabs at O'Hare because they're going broke.

A lot of them are already so broke, the cab IS their home. Shame on the City of Chicago for breaking the backs and shaking the souls of honest, hard-working men.

-Mike Foulks

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

O'Hare is right. Inexperienced drivers always start from the same place - O'Hare. Most trips are downtown. Average fare is $35. Take off $2 for the MPEA tax.

In a 12 hour shift a cabdriver will load five times. Net revenue for the day is $165. Gas is $35. Average lease is $50.

Driver takes home $80 after 12 hours. It's not enough, even for an entry level job. Now throw in there the likelihood of getting tickets or costly accidents and the job isn't very attractive.

Any arguments with my figures?

Salim

Re: A "Test Run" for George and Mike first?

Mike wrote: "Maybe we could each do a 'test run' together on a particular day, whaddya say? I could do it next Sunday night 6PM-6AM (when it is VERY busy at O'Hare) or next Thursday night 6PM-6AM. Do you work 6AM-6PM or at night or 24 hours? I'd like to do it on the same day as somebody else does 6AM-6PM."

It may be a good idea for George and Mike to start this "test run" first. May be one or all of the CCO members can help to set-up this "benchmark" sooner.

When will it be happend?

Re: Re: A "Test Run" for George and Mike first?

why u bringin george into this? mike wasn't talkin' to george. it was to that other guy. and why u tryin to tell the CCO and all its members they oughta take a whole freakin shift in some exercise to see how little we drivers can possibly make by only going to ohare as many times as possible in a 12 hr shift. yeah, thats what i wanna do with my time, waste it losing money for the cause.

hey yi, please.. enough with your suggestions.

Re: Re: Re: George has a question, Mike has the answer.

Either you don't like the question, or you don't like the answer. A test run is not my suggestion, and I cannot offer any alternatives for George's benchmark.

A simple solution is there, to work with Mike and his 52 members of CCO, if a benchmark is needed.

Have you ever heard any questions that Mike cannot answer?

Re: Re: Re: Re: George has a question, Mike has the answer.

yi yi yi,

you're not reading the questions in their proper order, nor with any understanding. george asked the question how much should a cabdriver make. like, what is appropriate remuneration for the hours, the risks, the responsibilities, for a driver to make a decent living for their family.

then some other driver segues off into deciding that what a driver who only goes to Ohare 4 or 5 times a shift deadheading one way is how to determine an average shifts pay. this is ludicrous. no one does this. after one or two days a person of avg intelligence would conclude this strategy does not work to make money.

then mike chimes in to agree that someone should test this hypothesis. even if they did, it would prove nothing. the data gathered would not be useful in any way to answer george's origninal question.

please. try to pay attention. and try not to make suggestions for other people to follow through on. its really not your business to be telling other people what they should be doing. its annoying.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: George has a question, Mike has the answer.

You mean Mike, a driver with 10-year experiences, is not qualified enough to answer George's original question?

I don't think so. Please try again!

I don't understand you here, Yi... could you re-post something clearer?

Yi,

I don't understand your posting. Could you re-post something clearer? Are you making a statement or asking a question (or both)? Who is supposed to answer? Who are you telling to 'try again' and what do you mean by that?

-Mike Foulks

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

You mean Mike, a driver with 10-year experiences, is not qualified enough to answer George's original question?

I don't think so. Please try again!

Re: May be you SHOULD read the question again, Mike

George is asking how much a taxidriver SHOULD make.

Do you make more than you SHOULD, or less than you SHOULD?

Is there anyone of CCO making more or less than he SHOULD?

Are you qualified enough, or anyone from CCO, to answer George's question?

Can you give George a benchmark for what he is looking for in his next issue?

Re: Re: May be you SHOULD read the question again, Mike

Yi Tang,

George Lutfullah ordered you to get off this site, so go back in the hole where you came from. Do you understand? I don't think so because you are stupid.

Mr. Faarax

I understand the question, Yi.

Yi,

I understood the question quite clearly. I responded to it briefly with a promise to post a longer reply at a later date.

You seem to be reading posts in the wrong order. I was replying to Mr. Abunassar's post. Chill out.

I make less than I should, as almost all cabdrivers are making less than they should.

I think I'm 'qualified' to answer George's questions? What are your requirements for somebody to be qualified?

I'm not sure about the 'benchmark for what he is looking for in his next issue', as you put it. Your confusion seems a bit contagious.

-Mike Foulks

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

George is asking how much a taxidriver SHOULD make.

Do you make more than you SHOULD, or less than you SHOULD?

Is there anyone of CCO making more or less than he SHOULD?

Are you qualified enough, or anyone from CCO, to answer George's question?

Can you give George a benchmark for what he is looking for in his next issue?

Thanks for breaking down Yi Tang...

Mr. 'Doofus',

Thank you for breaking down Yi Tang. It seems that he and a few others think that I work for George Lutfallah, who they despise, or that I am partners with him somehow. This reflects their 'paranoia'.

Yi Tang's continued attempts to obviously or subtly link the Chicago Cabdriver Organization (CCO) to Mr. Lutfallah are for his own selfish purposes...to falsely associate a cabdriver-organization that he and others have failed to create (the CCO) with a well-known entity (The Chicago Dispatcher) which they abuse to get some attention and a false sense of power from those willing to listen when they claim it is 'secretly' working against the interests of cabdrivers.

Their animosity towards Mr. Lutfallah stems from the 'Snakes in the Morning' article he published criticizing Mr. Prateek Sampat's 'role' in the 'strike' and his behavior at the press conference.

At the time, I thought that Mr. Lutfallah's opinion was overstated, but I quickly concurred with Mr. Lutfallah, not because of his article, but because of my personal dealings with Prateek in the weeks afterward. Mr. Sampat is a 'snake' at any hour of the day or night.

Now, to get to the business at hand...

I agree with you that this notion of finding out whatever a cabdriver could make by deadheading to O'Hare for 12-hours is useless. I was simply challenging the numbers that Mr. Abunassar was presenting because they didn't seem actual or factual. I was only offering to perform this silliness myself instead of resorting to what so many cabdrivers do...assert their 'opinions' as 'facts'.

I also was trying to include somebody else so that whatever we came up with would have that much more credibility.

I would NEVER ask CCO Registered-Members or any other cabdriver to waste their valuable time for this, or in any other way.

Trust me, Yi is MORE ANNOYING when he tells you what you should NOT be doing. I'm glad you said it first so I could second it.

But, Yi has provided many of us with a lot of information. He should be respected for at least that.

I am so glad that you have decided to start posting, 'doofus'...could you choose a better name so it doesn't look like we're trying to insult you when we reply...Mr. 'Doofus'?

You are not a doofus, are you? (Just please, please, don't be Wolfgang J. Weiss!)

-Mike Foulks

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

yi yi yi,

you're not reading the questions in their proper order, nor with any understanding. george asked the question how much should a cabdriver make. like, what is appropriate remuneration for the hours, the risks, the responsibilities, for a driver to make a decent living for their family.

then some other driver segues off into deciding that what a driver who only goes to Ohare 4 or 5 times a shift deadheading one way is how to determine an average shifts pay. this is ludicrous. no one does this. after one or two days a person of avg intelligence would conclude this strategy does not work to make money.

then mike chimes in to agree that someone should test this hypothesis. even if they did, it would prove nothing. the data gathered would not be useful in any way to answer george's origninal question.

please. try to pay attention. and try not to make suggestions for other people to follow through on. its really not your business to be telling other people what they should be doing. its annoying.

Re: Thanks for breaking down Yi Tang...

somebody call me a doufas.

Where's my bar of soap?

There's a mouth cryin' out to be washed.

Re: Re: Thanks for breaking down Yi Tang...

again!

this proves that the doufas is Wolf Weiss.

i knew it!

Re: Re: Re: Thanks for breaking down Yi Tang...

sheep in wolfs clothing don't know how to spell doofus. would you please stop posting as other people on this site. please stick to your known names and aliases. i seem to recall you stating somewhere back a few weeks ago that you only post under your own name. now someone says you post under a bunch of different names. and now i take it you are posting under other posters names. that seems a little bit unethical and dishonest to me. could you please stop? thank you.

Re: Thanks for breaking down Yi Tang...

no i'm not that sheep in wolfs clothing. thanks for asking though.

Re: Re: Thanks for breaking down Yi Tang...

Hey Wolf,

You don't need to be a wolf in sheeps clothing. You are a Wolf without your clothes. Ahwooooooooooooooo!

Re: How much should taxi drivers make? MORE.

My short answer to the question is simply this:

Chicago cabdrivers should be making a lot more than they currently can. We need a significant fare increase.

I will post a much longer reply within a week when I have the time.

-Mike Foulks, President, Chicago Cabdriver Organization (CCO)

Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make? MORE.

Mike,

The trouble is trying to sell that to the city. Everybody wants more pay.

I think we need to benchmark what we should be making and compare that to what we are making.

George Lutfallah
Chicago Dispatcher

Scratching the surface

George === It takes some time to compose anything worth considering as I am sure you understand. For that reason, a much longer posting will follow in a few days.

My perspective is different from that of most other drivers - for better or worse, I have been part of the industry for close to 40 years having begun to drive at the time of the Democratic National Convention of 1968 ("The Whole World is Watching"). Not having driven since 1975, my knowledge of what drivers make is only by way of hearsay from them = that, and access to thousands of driver tax returns used to prepare affidavits concerning the value of time lost by drivers after they were hurt. I know the returns reflected only just a small portion of their income - save for perhaps half a dozen drivers who were super patriots and told the absolute truth and paid a fair measure of taxes to this great country of ours.

I also know that over half of the drivers didn't report a dime of income - they lived under the table and continue to do so right down to the present. Over the years, I have presented thousands of injury claims for drivers who had to say they continued to work while hurt rather than have to admit they just didn't file tax returns - they lost plenty of time, but they couldn't prove it without exposing themselves to prosecution for tax evasion or causing themselves to be impeached in court.

To get a measure of what cab drivers make and, through that, what they should make, you are going to need to get honest cab drivers. This is a tough commodity to find. I doubt I've come across half a dozen who told the God's truth in a Form 1040 in 32 years of representing them - I've had over 5000 cab drivers as clients over the years. Of course, the pervasive dishonesty among drivers in respect to income reportage makes it much the more difficult to gather reliable statistics to present to Commissioner Reyes or the Transportation Committee in making a case for a meter raise.

But in the 21st Century there ARE ways to get at some of the numbers: meters DO keep tabs on revenue a cab generates - it's done electronically, and those meters have no motivation to lie. Yi Tang has the technical sophistication to give you ways of tapping meters for data. Prognostication based on what the meters show along with the cost of gasoline, mechanical work, car washes, license fees, interest payments on loans used to purchase cars and/or medallions and typical costs of fines at 400 West Superior can be used to get to a reasonable approximation of the gross income of a typical driver - without taking tips into consideration, of course. That figure varies from driver to driver because many spend a good bit of a 12 hour shift sitting in restaurants, OTB parlors, the lot at O'Hare, sleeping at home or dozing at posts, etc. Plenty of them are "minute men" these days: the kind who drive from 5:00 A.M. until 5:59 P.M. when they get to the gas pump. They have to be. But there are all types.

The income of a new-bee driver is probably easiest to focus in on based on a number of assumptions even without a PhD in Economics.

Further detail will follow in the next couple of days as indicated above. The gathering of figures is no small task because of the obstacles the drivers present for themselves, and I do believe this is the only way the DCS and the City are ever going to be sold on a significant fare hike. Homework is hard to do in an industry where the participants are so fiercely independent.


Donald Nathan

Re: Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make? MORE.

George,

Briefly...not every cabdiver wants a fare increase, for both good and bad reasons. I have doubts on 'selling' anything to the 'city', if you mean the Daley Administration (which includes DCS Comissioner Reyes and Shellie Riedle).

I also think that the range of 'what we should be making' will be great, and that our adversaries will focus on the low end. 'What we are making' will be regarded with a lot of suspicion, and again, our adversaries will focus on the wrong end of the range.

This is why I still believe that the request for meter receipts and the like is not a genuine attempt to treat the drivers with the respect they deserve.

It seems by the DCS testimony at the hearing that what was provided by drivers was abused to serve the interest of the City to recommend a denial of any fare increase.

The most obvious factor which has changed since the last fare increase is a very public one...

Just look at the prices of gasoline posted at the corner gas station.

If we can't get the City to agree that what we need is at least 'MORE', then I don't think the City is the most productive route to take to get what we need.

It is through the Transportation Committee and the Alderpersons themselves our relief will finally come.

-Mike Foulks, President, Chicago Cabdriver Organization (CCO)

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

Mike,

The trouble is trying to sell that to the city. Everybody wants more pay.

I think we need to benchmark what we should be making and compare that to what we are making.

George Lutfallah
Chicago Dispatcher

Re: Re: Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make? MORE.

See Mike, we agree on the essentials.

This is exactly what I have been "spewing" and preaching about for over a year now.

THey use our inability to come with the private financial to deny a raise.

They City should be looking at the City, ****** State and Federal economic indicators like the rest of the business world to determine if and when a rate increase is needed.

And they should be required by law to do so.

Thanks for putting it so clearly. Good job, dog!

Wolf
( 狼來了)

PS: I believe that The Troll, Cyberman, The Analyst, The Insider, The Outsider, The Sidewinder, Behinder and a host of others would agree, too.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make? MORE.

They City should be looking at the City, ****** State and Federal economic indicators like the rest of the business world to determine if and when a rate increase is needed.

Those asterics in previous post is not a prohibited word, it was C O U N T Y as in Cook C O U N T Y economic indicators.

Wow, software error results in over-enforcement of the filter.

wjw

Thanks, Wolf.

Thanks, Wolf.

I would lick your hand, but I consider that type of behavior disgusting. Besides, you just used it to pat my head and I have been rolling around in so much dog **** since our 'Master' (Daley) rewarded our loyal service with a bath.

If we are offered kibble then we might bite the hand that 'feeds'.

A reasonable rate increase should only come when we cabdrivers ask for one. This is, after all, OUR BUSINESS.

Woof, Woof!

-Mike Foulks

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

See Mike, we agree on the essentials.

This is exactly what I have been "spewing" and preaching about for over a year now.

THey use our inability to come with the private financial to deny a raise.

They City should be looking at the City, ****** State and Federal economic indicators like the rest of the business world to determine if and when a rate increase is needed.

And they should be required by law to do so.

Thanks for putting it so clearly. Good job, dog!

Wolf
( 狼來了

PS: I believe that The Troll, Cyberman, The Analyst, The Insider, The Outsider, The Sidewinder, Behinder and a host of others would agree, too.

Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make? MORE than WHAT?

I think George means by this issue as much as anything how much a cab driver ought to be making in American society, given American standards for remuneration at various jobs.

A tough one to figure. We're in the transportation industry. What value does society place on the skills of people in that profession?
What value ought society to place on them? I kept saying we are in a low-skills profession until a Londoner objected (not the cheery Alan Fisher!) And so I have tried to moderate my view on this topic. But maybe I'm thinking like a yuppie----I think you
should be paid for a skill, when in point of fact in many professions you get paid for what a combination of what the market will bear and what your union can force people to pay you.

I think George's comparison to bus drivers is a good one. They make pretty good pay as fixed-route transportation specialists.

Hacks don't work a fixed route. Should we be paid
less or more for our freedom in this regard? I say close to as much as bus drivers. Our role in the transportation scheme of a city, though less sexy and conspicuous as buses and trains, is close to being as important. It seems to me there was
some transportation professor somewhere bemoaning
(at least the American) lack of appreciation for cabs in a general philsoophy of American transportation.

How about the danger of the job? Does society pay people more to work dangerous jobs? Not always, I guess.

The powers-that-be have an immense effect on what a cab driver makes, since they determine the vital cabs-to-business ratio in a given market and in regulated markets determine he fare levels. But as we know, they're political, they seldom look at the philosophical issue of what a cab driver ought to have a chance to make in pay. They have a lot of people to keep happy, least of all the cab
driver. They adjust the fare level and amount of cabs allowed in the market to please the cab taking public and other interests.

I'm not answering Mr. Lutfallah's question. I would say that in a given market examine what a bus driver makesfor a forty hour week and make some formulaic adjustment, with precise reasons for doing so —tell us why, precisely a cab driver should be earning less than a fixed route driver — there are perhaps many valid reasons---and figure out the cab driver's
rightful pay from there.

Al Marotta
Boston, MA

Re: Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make? WHose Decision Is It Anyway?

Much of this discussion seems to be based on what others -- society, the City, passengers, other cab drivers, lawyers, doctors and tribal Chiefs -- deem an appropriate "value" level for our services.

What is our presumed, estimated, theoretical "value" worth to any of them?

From a vantage of worker/labor history, a cab driver, like any other "machine operator" is a necessary evil, an expense, a mere extension of piece of capital equipment (the machine a cabbie operates).

Ideally a cab driver or any person who engages in manual labor is the highest form of practical energy: self-directed, no buttons, switches or software required.

That is the number one reason why passengers request receipts for the end of trip, it is a tax-deductible expense.

To the governing authorities a cab driver and the taxi he/she operates is a valuable source of revenue.

As things stand now with respect to a cab driver's relationship to the general public, a cab driver is necessary, globe-warming evil; to the City, a cab driver is source of cash, to the taxi owners from whom a cab driver leases, a paying steady customer.

That's the down-and-dirty, bare essential truth.

Maybe cab drivers need to stop asking others what they are worth, what their value is, what they should get paid.

But to do that you need to consider that those who have already asked that question have come to the cold, hard reality, the inescapable fact that there have to be very basic, systemic changes in the relationships between drivers, owners, and the City.

The bad news: There are powerful forces at work, directly and through proxy that have and will continue to maintain the current status quo of the relationships that now exist - the power elite, someone called them.

The infant "movement" to identify this situation, to address the problems and offer appropriate changes inherent in this system, has been soundly quashed at practically every turn by the very people who would be the beneficiaries of such changes.

الذئب

How much should be enough? To anyone with kids of any age, here's some advice.

Subject: Bill Gates speech

Love him or hate him, he sure hits the nail on the head with this! To anyone
with kids of any age, here's some advice.

Bill Gates recently gave a speech at a High School about 11 things they did not and will not learn in school. He talks about how feel-good, politically
correct teachings created a generation of kids with no concept of reality and how this concept set them up for failure in the real world.

> Rule 1 : Life is not fair - get used to it!

> Rule 2: The world won't care about your self-esteem. The world will expect you to accomplish something BEFORE you feel good about yourself.

> Rule 3 : You will NOT make $60,000 a year right out of high school. You won't be a vice-president with a car phone until you earn both.

> Rule 4 : If you think your teacher is tough, wait till you get a boss.

> Rule 5 : Flipping burgers is not beneath your dignity. Your Grandparents had a different word for burger flipping: they called it opportunity.

> Rule 6 : If you mess up, it's not your parents' fault, so don't whine about your mistakes, learn from them.

> Rule 7: Before you were born, your parents weren't as boring as they are now. They got that way from paying your bills, cleaning your clothes and listening to you talk about how cool you thought you were. So before you save the rain forest from the parasites of your parent's generation, try delousing the closet in your own room.

> Rule 8 : Your school may have done away with winners and losers, but life HAS NOT. In some schools, they have abolished failing grades and they'll give you as MANY TIMES as you want to get the right answer. This doesn't bear the slightest
resemblance to ANYTHING in real life.

> Rule 9 : Life is not divided into semesters. You don't get summers off and very few employers are interested in helping you FIND YOURSELF. Do that on your own time.

> Rule 10: Tel evision is NOT real life. In real life people actually have to leave the coffee shop and go to jobs.

> Rule 11 : Be nice to nerds. Chances are you'll end up working for one.

If you agree, pass it on.
If you can read this - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English -Thank a soldier!

Re: How much should be enough? To anyone with kids of any age, here's some advice.

amen, I think.

Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

as cab driver for mor than tweny years I tell you every cab driver know that making money is not the issue here and the gas prices will not effect the income that much. The issue here should be the unexplainable increase the price of the medallion and the monopoly and who is behind it. The city should work to find common intrest between preserving cab drivers dignity by allowing them to hold on their dream of owning their own medallion. Also trimming the influance of special group whose trying to control cab drivers destiny.

Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

Here's a posting that's right on the money --- gas prices do make some difference in a cab driver's day-to-day income, but the outrageous and ever rising price tag on medallions held by monopolists, many of whom aren't even living in the Midwest is much more distressing long term.

The real squeeze isn't just going to come from the oil barons around the planet, and the focus of the concerned in our community needs to be on controling this commodity first and foremost.


Donald Nathan

Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

The City resolutely ignores any talk of re-instituting the so-called "senior driver" medallion lottery.

It's Rule 18 or 19, which used to authorize the medallion lottery, but now authorizes the "auction," which should be outlawed, if it isn't, in light of state law and case law providing for "licensing" at cost to the licensing agency.

But in these economic conditions and times, as well “home rule” laws in the current Illinois State Constitution, which The Honorable Richard Daily helped write, to the City it means "act like the mob, take what you can get by hook or by crook."

Thus by manipulating medallion "auction" prices (setting fake prices), “auctioning or more accurately-“selling” instead of ISSUING the licenses, the City scores huge bucks and the "buyers" score more power and more cash generators (cab drivers behind the wheels of their cabs).

The current scheme of things: Push the price high enough to get single-medallion holders to sell out, which then can be gobbled up by front-men for the big fleets and "outsider" fleet operators, with unknown and undisclosed financial backing, from who-knows-where, even Russian and Kuwaiti "banking interests" might be involved.

It is not a new story: Little guy gets squeezed out, big guys take over, with the help of the government.

The idea of "trimming influence" really means making the lawful authorities RESPONSIBLE and ACCOUNTABLE for their decisions and actions.

But then you have to institute laws that govern the government and reduce or diminish or mitigate their current level of power and influence.

I would venture to speculate that the last thing our City government wants on its individual and collective back is more laws that protect the public from the government, in this case, cab drivers and medallion holders.

Re: Re: Re: How much should taxi drivers make?

After readig your artical agree one hundred pecent but the government has the laws it needid, but it needs the will to infors it .
examble: one company it keeps over hundred cabs in it"garage to keep demand high in the street for cabs so they justify thir increases the weekly leass.
the city shuld make sure every cab fits to be on the street, be on the street at rush hour time.